Saturday, August 8, 2009

Time for another post about those crazy horsepeople!

I spent most of the day with a colicky horse (not mine, and yes, she is okay - but just a nasty gas colic, trying to roll, curling lip, "parking out" when she stood still - very, very uncomfortable) so this will be a short one, but I saw a new kind of crazy today and thought I'd post about it and see who has a similar story!

Person A traded horse A to person B for horse B. Upon further examination, horse B had a serious defect that was going to prevent his intended use. After much discussion, some threats and the usual drama, person B returned horse A to person A...

With his tail cut off at the hocks and every other mane braid lopped off at the roots.


I mean, gee, I guess it's better than like, slicing a tendon, but WTF? Who does something like that? At this point the owner of horse A is just happy he's home and safe and has no plans to resell him.

So tell me, what's your crazy story about a sale or a trade or a lease gone bad?
E-mail me and I'll post the comments.


“At least she got him (the sold horse) back alive....

I leased out my pregnant mare and her 2 year old daughter to a lady in Oklahoma (Cecilia "Sandy" Jarvis) who said she'd show the foal and agreed she wouldn't breed the 2 year old until she was 3--she said she might show her in the meantime but was so interested in breeding her she wanted to take her, so I agreed considering I was changing jobs at the time and had no where to keep them. Six months later I found out the foal had died, my mare had died and she didn't call to tell me--she said she died "a couple of weeks ago" and my filly was returned to me emaciated (pictures attached--gray filly). She claimed the foal was killed by dogs and my mare died "from old age," but after seeing my filly in this state it's not hard to figure out what happened to the other two horses. I still owned the mare that died yet she never contacted me to tell me she was having any problems or even that she had passed away. If she had nothing to hide, why didn't she call me right away when she died? She didn't tell me until I called HER!

A few months later another gal had to go rescue her pregnant mare that was emaciated (and about to foal any day) from her as well (picture of palomino in the barn). We've documented everything, had the pally seen by a vet and document her condition, sent in everything to the proper authorities, but of course nothing is done. Gotta love a small town....

This woman continues to ask for more horses to lease online and has excuses for everything of course (her excuse with the palomino was that she wasn't told she needed extra feed. Well duh, a 16.1H mare about to foal is going to need food). Not sure what it's going to take to stop her from taking other people's horses and doing this to them. (FHOTD in: Hopefully this blog)

I share this nightmare only to help make other people aware of how bad it can really get. If I would have done more investigating, I would have found that she has been suspended from AQHA since Nov 2007 and apparently she's also suspended from APHA and recently even got her daughter suspended. I would have found with just a few inquiries that she was behind on her obligations and several other suspicious circumstances, but I didn't. I saw that she showed, she seemed to be very caring when she picked up my girls, and I made assumptions that I'll regret the rest of my life.

Fortunately my girl is back to her healthy self, a bit stunted and I can no longer feed her with other horses because she's so overprotective of her feed, but she's with me now and will be the rest of her days. I'll never forgive myself for letting her dam go, though.

It's sad, but apparently you can't trust anyone anymore. Even if you don't post my comment, please let your readers know to do their homework before ever letting their horses leave their hands.”

“Hi, I have a good one for you... i had this mare who i rescued and i wanted to keep her. my "friend" who also operated a "rescue" wanted her so badly. this mare needed lots of work she had to be sedated after kicking my farrier i sold her to my friend who promised a "forever home" and a agreement that i get first chance to buy her back if ever sold. well she paid me with a bad check then turned around and sold the mare who was not broke to a 11yr old kid as a kid safe broke horse and made quite a profit.i managed to hunt her down the girl got injured after being bucked off. her dad got injured after getting bucked off she kicked bucked etc. she had NO training. the lady told this girls family she was "kid safe" and never kicked anyone.then refused to take her back. i wasn't able to find her in time to save her she went to a dealer and got shipped. this made me sick i thought this lady was my friend and to do this to this poor horse. she was a good horse but needed time and training. i wish i could have found her in time...and on this Lady's website she is still on it advertised in the success area as "forever home""

“I've had the same thing... mane and tail butchered... on a horse I'd had out on a "trial before buy." They then proceeded to say they should charge me for the "grooming".

I also had a friend of a friend that used to come out to ride with us get REALLY attached to one of my geldings- to the point of forgetting he didn't belong to her. She did the "tail to the hocks" and roached his mane and tail one day without asking me while I was down at the house getting sodas. He's a paso fino, btw. Grrr. I really chewed her out and she cried. And this isn't a teenager- just some 30something woman. Sheesh!

“well, we had a pony that these people took on a short trail period to see if he would be suitable. They were friends of friends and aquaintences to us so we knew he'd be in no danger. We told them though he had been shown in kid's western classes several years previos he was mostly a trail horse. Turns out while they had him for a short two weeks they lopped his mane off (poorly), threw english gear on him and took him to a show and said he was their horse. Surprise, surprise, he didn't place (they even did jumping) and they promptly returned him to us after and told us he was no good. My mom was fit to be tied when they told her what they had done. They had never expressed and interest in showing either but what ticked my mom off was that they would actually cut the mane of a horse they had only on a two week trial. and that they would show the horse without consulting the owners... as their own horse. And our friends couldn't believe it either as it seemed so out of character. I guess you just never know! “

“I traded my 13 yr old mini gelding (with cart/tack/etc) to my friend for a very sweet 4 yr old TWH mare that was green broke. About two weeks later my friend calls me up and explains she wants to give away my mare to a little girl. She had already talked to the girl and her parents to 'make sure it was ok' before she even thought about calling me! I was LIVID! My friend kept telling me that the little girl (an 8 yr old) wanted to learn how to train a horse and my mare was perfect for her.

It was finally settled through much yelling and screaming, but everything worked out and now people know that the mare is MINE. The continuing barn drama is fun though. The little girl now thinks I 'stole her horse' even though the mare was mine from the get-go.”

“in response to your sale or lease gone bad.....
I had two beautiful, registered QH mares I had to sell because I was moving, but i had invested that spring to breed them to top dllar stallions as we were raising cutting horses. The mares were in TOP condition, even still loped daily, fat, shiny, slick, etc.
I decided to lease the first mare, as in case I was able to find a horse property. I had clients I taught lessons to their little girl, (these people were teachers) . They were wanting to lease the first mare, then bring her back to me before or around the time the foal came. I agreed & they took the mare down 6 hours from me, to their new home, & things were going fine. Then they decided the daughter needed to own the mare, because she loved her so much. I agreed, as long as I got the colt, as they were friends I decided to give them a great deal on the mare. (she had won $60,000 in earnings, was sound, healthy, finished, safe for kids) So I told them $3000, if they did decide they wanted the foal, it would be $1000 extra, (the stud fee). They denied the foal, promised me the foal would be mine. Like a complete dumbass, I TRUSTED them & sent the papers on the mare.
They never told me there was a baby. I bugged them. They finally stated it was dead. I found out several months later that it is very much alive, in fact they went behind my back & got the papers to register it from the stallion owner. They are taking me to court because I wont sign the papers as the owner of mare at time of foaling....Im out the colt. Thats what I get for trusting "Friends". And they are teachers, tell me how that is for their children to see that? Just taking a colt that is not theirs. No paperwork between us, as I was trying to do a good deed, & trust someone.
Number 2 mare. She is dead broke & dog gentle, sweet as pie, too big for a cutter. A lady had some people come buy a horse from her that immediatly hurt their teenage daughter, after saying it was safe for kids. She didnt want to give the money back, but knew I had a good for kids mare. She had a horse trailer I was interested in, so offered to give me the trailer in trade I give the mare to those people. So, they came to see her, took her right away. I had to go to work, so she was supposed to bring the trailer by that evening & drop it off. Instead, when I got home, I had a big old mule headed bay gelding with the worst attitude I ever met sitting in my pen. I couldnt sell him. He was AWFUL, & I didnt want anyone to get hurt. I gave him away & heavily warned the owner of what I had learned about him in only a few days. I constantly had tried to contact this lady about our deal gone wrong. Nothing. I should of wated til the trailer was there to do the deal, of course, my stupidity..
On mare number 2, I trusted them the same way to give me back my foal. THEY DID, with no problems. I was very surprised, but relieved there are still decent people out there. They had felt bad for me losing her for free. But I was glad she was with a teenager who loved her, so I was okay with it.
When they brought her by to wean (they didnt know how, so I told them I would do it, & keep the mare for free) this is what the mare looked like. Starving to death. This is a 16 hand QH mare, that was so stout & beautiful. I educated them on proper feeding & health care, not just once, but many times, even in writing. They thought she looked fine. I was horrified. I would go by & check on her, take her feed, etc. I contacted the police & animal control. Nothing was done, they said she wasnt bad enough to be a neglect case. HOW??????
It has been a very tedious pain of getting anyone to notice her. FINALLY, someone has stepped in on the animal rescue team who has seen her recently, who has FINALLY done something. She is still with these owners, but only has a few more weeks til they are done giving them chances, too. I am just sick about it. We are in Texas, where it seems like it's ok for people to let their horses "rough it". It just goes to show that any horse, top bred or grade, can still come into these circumstances. These people seemed so great, so caring, they also had plenty of money to assure me that she would be well cared for. Maybe we should be scared to ever sell our beloved horses. We have no control once they are not ours anymore.”

“Nineteen months ago, I traded my well trained, 14.3 hand, sport pony mare to a woman for a 16.2 hand, green as grass warmblood gelding. She had bought the WB for her 11 year old daughter who got tossed, dragged, stepped on, and scared to tears by the big goof. He is big and fashionable so no one tried him to see if he was trained. When I went to see the gelding, she said she was looking for a well trained, large pony (no bigger than 14.3h), preferably a mare and hopefully a bay to help her daughter regain her confidence. I had a 14.3h, bay mare that was training level 3 dressage. Her daughter tried her and loved her. She would call me up and tell me how much she loved the mare. I ended up feeling bad for the girl so I agreed to trade my mare for her gelding. Well for the first 17 months, the mare was the greatest horse ever. They invited me to their stable to introduce me to the coach as the breeder. (FYI, I stopped breeding five years ago but I like to keep track of my foals.) They invited me to watch the daughter's lessons so I could see how well they were doing. They called to brag about how much the daughter loved the pony. Then they moved.

I got a phone call telling me that the mare is not working out and that they don't want her. According to the woman, the trainer at their new barn got on the mare the second day she was there and tried to make her jump a course. The mare refused and "the trainer made her do it" which resulted in the mare slipping and bowing her tendon. She went on to say that the mare is green because she doesn't jump a full course and she is too "dressage-y" to really compete in hunter. (Apparenty she didn't realize that a dressage bred and trained horse would be naturally inclined to do dressage rather than hunter. Who knew???) She complained that the mare is too short for her daughter (despite 14.3h being her previous maximum size). She complained that her new coach said that being half Arabian made the mare too hot to show (Her purebred sire and I competed in provincial level dressage, did the open and Arab circuit... but Arabs are too hot to show?) She complained that the mare was too responsive (I thought being responsive to the rider was a good thing???). She complained that the mare was holding her daughter back from being "a true hunter-ista". She complained about everything and anything concerning the mare.

Her hints at trading back were instantly nixxed. It took me almost a year to undo a plethera of bad habits, but the WB is now going well and is not going back especially after seeing what my mare has become. She was sold without vices and perfectly sound mentally and physically. When I seen her a few days later, she freaked out on the cross ties, bit when being saddled, bounced around in the sand ring and refused to do what they asked. She is soured and spoiled, plus her leg is a mess. UGH!

I am currently talking to my BO and trying to juggle a few horses around to make room for her. I am going to buy her back but I feel sorry for the next person who sells them a horse. The mother is so wrapped up in living through her daughter and keeping with the status quo that I'm sure the next horse will fall short and need trading in too.”

“The first horse I bought back in 1985 was a OTTB. I purchased him for 600.00 from a man in Great Falls, VA. He was boarded at another families place, who was allowed to use this horse for their daughter. They were very unhappy that I was buying "their daughters" horse. Ironically, the day I was to pick him up, he was hurt. The man who was boarding him called me and said that the horse was found bleeding in the pasture and that they had wrapped the leg. They said he must have cut it on the fence. I rushed out to find Tommy standing in a blood-soaked "dressing" with blood visibly leaking out onto the stall floor. No vet had been called!!
I called my vet who came out and upon examination, told me that the cut was clean, like it had been done purposely to the fetlock. The wound was not caused by the fence as we had found no evidence when walking the pasture. It was too old to sew up, so we dressed it. My vet told me that if the horse had lost any more blood he would have needed a transfusion. He healed with pretty intense care, but to this day, I know that the jealous barn manager had done this. :(

Sheesh, you would have thought this experience 20+ years ago would have made me get out of the crazy, idiot-filled horse world!!! LOL”

“One of my work colleagues went to a race horse sale. He bought this mare and told me the next morning how good her breeding was and blah blah blah. Well, I went around to have a look at her and the damn thing had not just one bowed tendon, but 2! He is an idiot. I went with him to the next sale and helped pick out a very nice little gelding that is actually sound. “

"Years ago, I let a friend use my mare to breed and get a foal. The deal was, she breed my mare for a foal, in exchange for some training on my gelding. I really needed to sell the mare, but didn't want to part with her, so this was a good way for me to get some training on my gelding that I couldn't afford at the time, and still be able to hang on to my mare a little longer, maybe things would look better next year. Any way, she loved my mare so much, she said she'd like to buy her, but didn't have the money right now, but if I would wait until she had the foal, and she sold it, than she would pay me for the mare. I agreed, because I really liked my friend, and wanted the mare to go to a good home. She had the mare at her place, and was responsible for full care. Well during that year of waiting for a foal to come, she since bought another horse. I didn't say anything, because a deal was a deal, and I was sticking to it. Even though I could have used the money. When the foal finally came, I reminded her the mare was a hard keeper, she'll really need to pump the feed to her. She assured me she was. I get a call from her one day only to hear that she changed her mind on buying her, that if I wanted her I had to go to someone else's house to pick her up, because she took her there to be rebred after she weaned the baby. When I went to pick her up, Not only did I get a skinny malnourished horse back, Her feet were never trimmed in that year and a half, and on top of it I got a bill from the breeder! I can't believe they would breed a horse in that condition, they told me they hid her in the back barn because they didn't want anyone seeing a horse in that condition on their property. And they said they already put about 100 pounds back on her since she was there. Needless to say the friendship was immediately over when I called her on it. So I had months of rehabilitation on the horse and my conscience, along with a stud fee! I made everything right with the breeder, and the mare never left me again. And I learned a valuable lesson. Even if it's a close friend, always check on your horses! It sucked to learn the hard way, but at least I learned."

FHOTD in: I could not agree more. ALWAYS CHECK! ALWAYS CHECK! Even if it's your best friend from the 1st grade, ALWAYS CHECK!

"I lost a best friend over a horse lease. I had a beautiful purebred horse with a foal at her side. My friend lived about 200 miles away wanted to borrow her for a specific use that was more suited to my horse's breed than her own horses. I agreed on the condition that she purchase equine insurance for the duration. She agreed. I delivered the pair because they had no trailer. In person she again assured me that insurance would be purchased the next business day. About a month into it I asked again and was assured "yes" insurance had been purchased. About 3 months into the deal, I get a call that the colt is dead. Lots of tearful conversations later, it turns out that insurance was NOT purchased, but they would pay an agreed upon sum for the dead foal who was never seen by a vet to determine cause of death (because a. they knew and b. because they didn't want to pay for a vet call). I sent a third party to pick up the mare because I was too upset. When my mare arrived home she was a walking skeleton. Hello? No wonder the colt died! They starved. Then after making one or two payments they quit because that's all the colt was worth, in their opinion.

Never again!"

“we took in a friends horse to sell after she died in an accident. I didn't know any better, and let the horse go out on a 2 week trial in New York. After poor communication on their part, the horse came back severely underweight, over worked, and some cat had pissed on his blankets so they had to be junked. He was than sold to a wonderful woman who wanted a tail horse, but broke his leg after spooking of a turkey the day before she was going to pick up and was pts. Guess his sale was never ment to be.. “

“This is actually a "nice" crazy horse sale.

10 year old PF/Appaloosa mare. Have had her for sale in the past, but never "approved" the potential buyer(s). Had her on CL with several others for $500 each. Lady called me to see if she would be suitable for her 11 year old daughter's first horse. Daughter has been taking lessons for a couple of years.

I told her I didn't know. I had never put a child on the mare. I would have to see them together, riding, interfacing. They came over; daughter brought a buddy the same age who she explained, "has been riding since she was a kid."

Buddy did super well with the mare; buying girl did okay. Had a little trouble getting her to move, but no problems. (This mare is very "brio" but sensible. She is not a spook and bolt horse, but a stop and study the situation horse. I agreed it might work. Mama told daughter to go get her cash box. Daughter went to the car and came back with a little wooden treasure chest. She has been working every little chore and job for friends, family, neighbors that she could do for the past year-and-a-half to save for her first horse. She gave me a $100 deposit of mostly one's rolled up in a rubber band; I didn't know if I should laugh or cry.

Family also has two llamas who will share the pasture and barn. I told them we would deliver the mare because I wanted to be on the end of the lead when she saw those lamas for the first time. We did, and mare was absolutely terrified. We walked her up and down beside the pasture. She was trembling from head to tail, and sweating in terror. But she stood her ground--snorted and snorted and snorted. We put her in the pasture and told them to let her settle in for a few days before they tried to ride her. Three days later the mare was still hiding in a narrow alley beside the barn, only coming out when they would lead her.

I told them I wanted to be the first one to ride her in her new environment, so last Monday we traipsed back over there. I saddled her in the pasture, climbed on, yelled, "Let's go get us some lamas!" and started after the astonished lamas, who of course gave way to the crazy lady and the horse trotting after them. (I have used this mare for turnback in cutting, so she understands moving cattle and buffalo). We spent about ten minutes moving the lamas around the pasture, then took her outside and rode her. Everything was cool. The next day, the mare was out in the pasture grazing and drinking with her new herd.

Two days later, I get a frantic call. They had a "scare." The mare was laying flat on her side in the pasture. The father said they slept standing up, so they were ready to call the vet. Daughter called the mare's name and she jumped up. They thought she was probably having a heat stroke, so they watered her down. (Daughter has been spraying her down a couple of times a day in this heat; mare loves it.) So after I quit laughing, I explained that a horse that is very comfortable in its environment will lay down to sleep, and that was probably the first really good nap she had had since she got there!

This is really a match made in heaven. Family (seven kids from 7 to 19; all adopted) dote on the mare, father even more so. They are learning, and we are staying in close touch with them. They are going to switch trainers to one we have used for a number of years, and will take lessons on the mare part of the time."

“Made a trade with this outfit:

What an eye opener. Filly listed as ApHC and ICAA registration pending - discovered even the sire wasn't registered! We were assured of a registered filly. Several months later came the news that they really didn't think she could be registered to begin with. After some serious discussions regarding the changing of 'facts', including the truths we discovered, we sent in pics, filled out all paperwork required, paid all postage, and verified delivery of all documents to have registration accomplished including registration fees. And we were one of the fortunate ones!!!!

Thankfully our trade horses left that three stall facility (her husbands workshop and he hates horses in it) and have wonderful homes with plenty of food, vet care, and folks who love them.

During registration negotiations discovered this outfit put ApHC pending on everything. I groused around about it. Then they give made-up false numbers to the stock. Yep, I yapped about that. Now they just put 'registerable' (otherwise known as "Good Luck Sucker" to the horse world) on their foals/yearlings etc.

Considering how many they have burned - we are on a long list and I've talked to quite a few on that list - any wonder folks don't enjoy the real pleasure horses can give.”

“As a balance for crazy swaps – this is my swap win-win story.

I rescued a 12yo Shetland gelding from the local knackery (they called me knowing I wanted a pony and he was “too nice to dog”). He made an excellent companion to my 2yo WB Buckskin colt (registered with 4 breed societies, show winner). He also adores kids so I have given him to friends for their two little girls.
This left me with a rather lonely colt. I sat down and thought and considered and realised that I have not a lot of spare money and in my front paddock – 2 project TBs. I don’t have time for both.

I put up an ad proposing a swap for a 15.2 8yo chestnut TB mare for a male (gelding or stallion as I was happy to get the vet out) pony, up to about 12hh.

I received over 300 responses in 36 hours, some people couldn’t read and thought the mare was free – one man offered me a box trailer which actually I was interested in! I found a lovely girl, a vet nurse about 2 hours away who had a 5yo Mini stallion (plus papers!) she had decided to move on. We spoke for a week, exchanged photos, and she drove down with the pony: Ziggy. Ziggy was instantly pally with my colt, she was thrilled with the mare. We exchanged registration paperwork, rugs, and a page of the contact info and history for each horse.
After a month, I’m still happy, so’s she.”

“My dad works with a woman who has a pinto Saddlebred. While she was at her barn one day, a young girl came up to her asking about her horse being for sale. She declined, and the girl went on to ask the trainer about another pinto Saddlebred that was at the barn. They bought the second Saddlebred from the trainer, but then it started to show signs of lameness. The trainer took the horse back, and "took him to the vet." When the people finally got the horse "back", he was missing his tail, which had been sold to make a fake tail. Of course, the horse didn't even belong to the trainer in the first place. The rightfull owner of the horse found out and got the horse back, I believe, but, I'm not positive. The woman left the barn because of this incident, and now has her horse back at her place so that doesn't happen with her. We had money out at that barn too as I was taking an occasional Saddleseat lesson there, but, we too left after the woman told us this story.”

“I just orchestrated a trade between two friends. A been there. done that, dead broke, mega flashy, older teen gelding for a slightly bitchy but very solid midteen cowhorse mare.

You're scaring the stuffing out of me.....”

“Your story about the horse being returned with its mane and tail being cut made me think of something. At my barn there is a horse that has been virtually ignored by his owners since it turned out he had a back problem that prevented him from being ridden. Suddenly he doesn't matter to them anymore (which is really freaking sad, if you ask me, but I guess at least they're still paying his board).

Anyway, the neighbor's 12-year-old daughter asked the barn owner if she could brush the horse, and the BO okayed it with the horse's owners. Next thing we know, the kid's cut most of his mane down to about three inches long. It's a total hack job, but more importantly, it wasn't even her horse. I know she's only 12, but sheesh, even a 12-year-old ought to know that you don't do that to someone else's animal!”

“Sold a "foal in utero" to a lady in PA. My contracts are cut and dried. No refund unless the foal has something wrong with it. Simple as that, we know there can be allot of debate on that subject, mine are outlined pretty clear-genetic, conformation, illness, failure to thrive...etc.

So this filly was drop dead gorgeous when she was born, perfect in every way possible, comes from a proven cross and has champion sisters. This lady knew what she wanted, got referred to me by other clients that have purchased in utero foals from me. (I breed them FOR them custom, I've been doing this for 20+ years, gotten to the point that I know what I'm going to get 99% of the time)(although those days of breeding are all but over)

At any rate, the filly was rejected by the purchaser because she had a snip on her nose. She had a little bit of pink skin. I'm telling you, just a TINY bit on her nose! Pink skin grossed her out so she refused to take the filly and demanded her money back!! I finally agreed to breed her another one, just to keep her happy. STUPID ME!! (mind you, this was in the day all babies sold quickly, these days it would be totally out of the question)

Its been an ongoing hassle ever since. If I where rich, I probably would have just paid her back after the SECOND filly was born (NO WHITE ON THE FACE) and she came up with some excuse not to ship her too. (she had a sore shoulder so she didn't want her).

This is the only woman EVER I have told to take a short trip off a short bridge. She didn't get a filly nor her money back.

And I still feel a bit guilty, but legally she is in breach, and I have no obligation anymore. Thank god she didn't actually get a filly, lord knows how she would have cared for her she was such a flake.... “

“I did one of those "owner A trades horse A with owner B for horse B" situations. I love my horse, but he is far from what they advertised. I did test ride him before I bought him, and he went well. A little sluggish, but they told me that it was a hot day out and he had been ridden already. Supposedly.

Their reason for selling was that he was waay to much horse for them, and he was too fast. They told me that he would make an awesome jumper, and had once cleared a four foot fence. (That, I thought later, could have been a red flag for "houdini horse" escape artist, but it wasnt). They had him named "Jupitor" (spelled wrong LOL). I quickly renamed him Koda. They wanted a slow, lazy horse for their daughter, which was EXACTLY what my AQHA horse was.

So I took him home in excited hopes for a great jumping carreer. After riding him several times, I realized it was not just a hot day. He was lazy. I had to work hard to even get him into a canter. So I have no idea why the considered him a hyper horse. I feel like they were probably just scared of him - he is a 16hh black horse with the "presence" of a percheron. Sort of intimidating for an inexperienced person. After months of jump training he still did the "stop before the jump and then step over it slowly" routine. He was in no shape or form a jumper. It took a whole year to finally get him to accept the fact that I refused to do anything other than jump. He is now doing DECENT at jumping, but he is no natural.

I later got complaint emails about my AQHA horse I traded, saying they "couldnt seem to find his gas pedal". Isnt that exactly what you asked for??? They wanted a slow lazy horse for their 10 year old daughter. I should have responded "Its probably hiding in the same place as "Jupitor's" gas pedal.."

Ah, well. Not necessarily what I wanted skill wise, but we have an amazing bond now and I am far from regretting the trade.”

“Well, not so bad that I had to ‘buy back’ the horse. LOL

Several years ago I was training and ‘hacking out’ sale horses for a man. I specialize in safe riding mounts for kids and timid adults. Anyway, we got in a mare, she was a small horse about 8 years old, and I could tell by the first ride that she would sell quickly. She was quite, gentle and really forgiving towards the rider; perfect for what we were selling!

So I got several prospected buyers interested in coming over to try her and I lined up two in one day. Prospective buyer no. 1 was a ‘trainer’ from an Atlanta/Conyers area farm. I knew that she was strictly looking for an animal for a client of hers for resale/commission. She tried the mare, and seemed to be satisfied, but left without a commitment or deposit on the mare. That was okay, I had another client coming that day.

Client no. 2 was a mother and her son that was looking for a nice, safe mount for pleasure riding. They both tried her, and were interested in buying her. I was really happy too because they seemed like the perfect fit! We went to turn out the mare, and then go back to talk it over… as we were turning her back out into the pasture, Prospective buyer no. 1 showed back up, and right in front of them declared that she had decided to buy the mare! The mother and pour little boy were very upset, and pretty dejected. I tried to smooth it out and assure that I would indeed have other animals appropriate for them in the near future, but I never heard back from them…

Oh well, if I had of known what was to transpire I would have told no. 1 that no. 2 had already put down a deposit!

For every horse or pony I sell, I tell the prospective new owner that the animals sells ‘as is’, and it is up to them to have the animal vetted out prior to the purchase. Sooooo, the same with this mare. The trainer declines to have her vetted, and puts down a holding deposit. All she got was an up to date coggins test and a receipt with the mare. Within the week she paid for the mare, loaded her up and off they went, into the sun set! LOL

Now, no news is good news, and several weeks (6 or 7) go buy and I don’t hear a thing about how things are going with the mare. Then one day out of the blue I get a call from the ‘trainer’ and was informed that as the mare was perfect, doing everything the she is asked of, and the new owners are very satisfied with the mare… there is one problem! The mare is ‘in foal’! Well... I stated out that I hadn’t a clue that the mare was bred, and that had she opted to have the mare vetted out that she would have known that before she bought the mare. Then I said that if the mare was such a good animal, that she should be excited that she was getting a ‘two for one’ deal! LOL The ‘trainer’ said that they really didn’t want to loose all the ‘ride time’ waiting for the foal, weaning etc., and really wanted to bring her back, and get a refund!

Bring her back ?!?!? I told her that I would have to give it some thought and talk it over with my partner. My partner NEVER buys back a horse for what he sells it for, and he just laughed! So I ended up calling her back, offering her less than we bought her for. She in turn then talked to her clients, and called me back and said that they just wanted their money back. I said no way. I received several (harassing)calls for me to refund monies and take back the mare over the next several weeks. I was professional about it, and offered to try and fine another horse/pony for them. Finally I just had to say: “Listen.. this is NOT Wal-Mart or K=Mart, we don’t have a return for cash policy! So I am sorry, I cannot help you.” L And that was that!

The calls ended then, thank goodness. Funny thing is, years later the ‘trainer’ ended up buying a Welsh pony mare that I had originally sold to another lady, and I actually started getting calls from her again. This time for ‘kids ponies ‘just like the Welsh mare she just bought! *I did inquire about what had happened to the o mare that was ‘in foal’ that I had originally sold her. She said: “oh well, she foaled, we sold the foal, and the mare is doing great with her owners!” Glad to hear that… The ‘trainer’ continued to call me at least twice a year asking to buy my pony Little Raskel, which is the son of the Welsh pony mare! LOL Good thing I kept it professional between us. I like having a ‘good name’ out there in the horse world!”

“In 2004 I had a yearling Arabian colt of exceptional pedigree. He broke his coffin bone and after we got him through the cast process and into a rim shoe, we just knew we didn't have the space to keep him confined to a stall for the prescribed 12 months of recovery. So we found a "supposed" Arabian breeder who lives in Meeker, OK to do a lease to purchase.

The lease to purchase was simple, after he came out of his rim shoe and went into a bar shoe with clips, about 8 months or so, they would purchase him. The contract was explicit that we did not guarantee that he was going to be able to breed anything at such a young age nor did we guarantee that he was going to be sound. Of course they gave us the story about how they would take their time, they didn't worry if he wasn't mature enough to breed at a two year old, they would just wait for him to grow up more, etc. He was exactly what they were looking for in pedigree, type, and conformation. She sent us video of her farm and personal references that checked out. She was able to provide him with a large foaling stall for the duration of his confinement. She even made alterations to the stall as per my wishes after seeing it on video tape.

He was shipped to them and the following breeding season it all went to hell in a handbasket. They were turning him out in the round pen before it was time for him to do that, they called complaining that they had parked him behind the butt of a mare in heat for two hours and he wouldn't breed her. Then they started complaining about how he was cow hocked. I tried to explain to them that he's been in a stall, with no exercise for almost a year! Of course he's cowhocked! I then got a call from another breeder down the rode who had come to the farm to see the horses and saw the colt. She called me and told me that he was in terrible physical shape. I called and demanded photos and video. What they provided me brought tears to my eyes. He was filthy, in a filthy stall and NOT the stall they had showed me. They then called and said that they were "no longer going to be putting any money into him". I asked what they meant. They meant what they said, they were not going to feed him etc! I called my shipper and by the graces of GOD he was about 50 miles away. However, she pulled a fast one and said the wasn't going to allow anyone on her property to pick him up. I had to have the Sheriff talk to her. The shipper went straight to the farm to pick him up. When he called me, words cannot describe. He said that the colt was almost emaciated, his feet hadn't been done in over four months, and the shoe on his injured foot was not the prescribed shoe AND it was another horses shoe. We boarded him at another farm in the area until he had gained some weight and his health papers were in order and then we had him shipped home.

The good ending is that he did completely recover from his injury and to this day is 100% sound. We sold him to a woman in the area about 3 years ago, she adores him, stays in contact and sends photos, and it will hopefully be a home for life”

“a very dear friend recently bought a black mare, she was well trained and of bloodlines that my friend wanted in her program. all went well and she bred the mare to her stallion. when she sent the dna to register the foal, turned out the mare was not the correct mare. it took quite a while to figure out the situation, breeder had no idea which or where original mare was or who the "imposter" was. turns out he has about 70 registered morgans, many of them black. finally figured out who was who, foal is now registered correctly, but not lineage my friend wanted to incorporate. seller is putting up a fight, said original mare "is lame now anyway", amongst other choice tidbits. our registration body (the AMERICAN MORGAN HORSE ASSOCIATION) says she should be happy that the mare she got is registered! seller is no longer taking calls and a little bit of sleuthing finds that is not the first time he has sent the wrong horse to a buyer. he also says "it's very hard to tell all these black horses apart." this is an on-going situation, so i won't use names, but i do want to send a special "thank you" to the AMERICAN MORGAN HORSE ASSOCIATION for helping it's members in good standing. nothing like knowing that you are paying dues and giving money to an organization that backs you up. Snark.”

“My goodness....what pettiness, what outright meanness.

Very saddening to hear this type of childish crap goes on.

I mean, c'mon, wtf!!!??”

“I leased 5 acres of horse property that was about 3 miles away from where I actually lived. I would go there 2-3 times a day to feed and check water. The lady that lived next door, lived there full time. Ann Johnson was her name. If I wasnt there at 8am for whatever reason, I would get nasty phone calls about how my horses are starving and looking over the fence at her horses eating. Ok, what horse doesnt look at another horse over the fence when they're eating and it's not?! She would sometimes call me at work to tell me my horses are just standing there with tummy aches. If she could find a reason to call me to complain, she did. I had 5 horses there at the time. All were happy, healthy and well fed year round. We lived in a area where it snowed in the winter, she thought my horses needed blankets. I cant even tell you how many phone calls I got about my horses needing blankets because they were SO cold. She drove me CRAZY! I broke down and went out and bought blankets for ALL of my horses (even the mini) so she would shut the **** up! I spent like $1,000. I did everything she ever bitched about. I even left work more than once to get there and find NOTHING wrong! Well, one day, I had to work at 6am. Well, my work was an hour away from there. So, I fed at 4am. Obviously my horses were done eating when she woke up and fed her 2 horses. Well, when I didnt show up at 8 to feed, I got a phone call which I didnt answer. I had very bitter feelings towards her at that point. That night when I went out to feed around 4-5pm, I found ALL my horses out and eating on the 5 ton of hay I had. As I got the 1st horse in the gate and reached down to pick up the hotwire gate, I noticed it wasnt broke, it was placed more inside of the pasture then out and it was sitting so nicely out of the horses way. Hmmm. Horses dont open gates in, they open them out, nor do they know how to open a hot hotwire gate that consisted of 3 handles that needed to be opened. Plus open the hotwire around the hay. I was so pissed I called her and told her to stay off the property and to not ever call me again unless there is blood and guts or a dead horse. I called the owner of the property and told her what was going on and she backed me up 100% and made a phone call herself. But did Ann listen? Nope. It happened two more times then I actually called the kittitas county police to come out and chat with her. Did that work? Nope. One more time and I had had it. I called her up and angerly and immaturly called her every name in the book and every other word was a swear word and every two senteces I told her to F off. The back side of the property was right next to a major highway. What if my horses had decided to step out into 60mph traffic? I coudnt do it anymore. I put all my horses up for sale. I was asking almost nothing for them so I knew they would sell. I wanted out of there SO bad. I sold 4 horses in one week and moved the last one to a boarding facility. When the owners of the property moved her horses back in the summer, guess what Ann started doing again! The owners bought like 15 "No Trespassing" signs and put them all over the fence lines and got the police involved again. I never kept up, but thats the last I knew. So stay away from Ann Johnson of Teannaway valley in Cle elum WA. She's F***ING CRAZY!”

“The experience I had doesn't involve selling or trading but still makes me think "WTF were they thinking?!?"

I boarded a horse I owned once, at a smaller "mom 'n pop" barn. The barn itself was nice, and the amenities were VERY good for the price. The man in charge was knowledgeable and we got along well. Well, I was done showing for the season, and allowed my horse to be outside all day, to just be a horse. He was put in another pasture with a horse of the same color, but different build. My horse was black, BS paint gelding, and this other horse was a black Morgan mare. So I come out to the barn one day, grab my halter to go catch my horse, and while I'm opening the gate to the small pasture he was out in, I notice that something looks HORRIBLY wrong. His tail, which nearly drug the ground was lopped off just above his hocks and his forelock that extended a good 3/4 of the way down his head was lopped off Stooges style, to around 5 inches long. I could not believe my eyes, and just as I was turning around to go find the man to tell him what I'd seen, he was walking out to talk with me. He told me that his teenage son usually feeds the horses, and had cut my horses tail and forelock to try and differentiate between my horse and THE MARE!!! because he couldn't tell my gelding from the mare in the pasture. Wow. The thing is, I'd moved about 2 months prior, due to some major drama at another barn, and while I suspected that his son might have known someone at the previous barn, I had no way to prove it. The man/father was EXTREMELY apologetic, and while I was livid at first, there was really nothing I could do. At least it wasn't during show season. Heh. “

“Chapter One: Posted horse for sale because I was afraid to ride him. (Classic story of older lady returning to horses after 20 years and buying too much horse.) Stated the fear IN THE AD.

When buyer came to look, he asked me to ride outside. I consented. While tacking up, the buyer hung a 2 foot x 3 foot piece of sheet metal on a wire in a tree, AND DID NOT TELL ME. He was smiling when he said, "well, I refrained from jumping out of the woods at least."

So I ride out, go around the corner and there it is, flapping in the wind. We were fine, but I was literally shaking on the rest of the ride. Luckily I had a very good friend along on her horse and she talked me through it.

He bought the horse, kept him at my barn for two weeks.

Chapter Two: Windsucking had been disclosed IN THE AD and the buyer was okay with it and had signed forms stating that he was okay with it. Horse windsucked in front of the buyer for two weeks at my barn. He moves the horse to his home, then wants to return him 2 days later because of the windsucking. Seriously. Total d-bag buyer.”

"We had a horse in race training with formidable speed which was evidenced with his first official timed works so that he could get a stall at the racetrack. The trainer had her own favorites so she "gave him a hair." This is something I'd never heard of before even with all the nasty stories about what trackies do to horses. Her groom told us later after he was pulled out of that barn for "lameness" that "giving a hair" means pulling a tail hair and using a needle pulling the hair between foreleg tendons and clipping off the ends so it doesn't show. It doesn't cripple the horse but it sure creates a lot of short term problems. Another instance at breed show some years back, we had a top halter mare who was just starting English performance and someone lopped off her beautiful long tail hairs completely, just below the tailbone, to totally spoil her looks for showing. Many in that breed at that time also had taken to having security guards hired to patrol their stalls after hours as administering prohibited drugs to the competition was a fav way of removing said competition - such as anthelmintic wormers which test as a "mask" for other drugs which is why it is prohibited. Won't kill a horse but sure got owners in deep do-do with the show associations."

"I had a mare that was sent out on a leaseback foaling. I thought we had done our homework - the lady was recommended by friends in the business, came to our place and seemed to check out well. Our mare was to ship to OR from CA on her dime, get bred have a first foal for her then be rebred and returned to us after weaning once again shipped by her - sounds simple right?

NOT our mare went to OR we received information every few months then pics of the new filly then nothing at all. No response to phone calls, letters, calls to her trainer, even calls to this ladies Mom who said she had no idea where this woman was. As some background this was a 50 something lady who was also a minister. Finally after a couple of months of frantic searching I find this lady in Sacramento, CA as a minister in a church and still could not get her to call or let me know if my mare was alive or not. Out of desperation I called the head minister explained the situation and his employees inability to let me know where my mare was and how she was. He ended up telling me where the mare was going to be and that I could come get her (we were 300 miles away). We went immediately and picked up the mare locked in a round pen with no shelter in 110 degree heat and pregnant - she had been dropped at a boarding stable with 1 week paid board. Gee what a minister huh??? The mare was thrilled as I have ever seen her to see us - I believe she has seen how the other half lives and is tickled to be home with us now.

Needless to say I will never ever lease a horse out again between the anxiety and hours spent searching and imagining the worst there is nothing worth it there are too many kooks in the horse world."

"I had a very nice shetland pony at one time. It was from himwe learned all about foundering and laminitis. We learned to manage his diet, weight and hoof care and he was a happy and healthy little guy. He taught my daughter many lessons and became a favorite at the dressage barn where she took dressage lessons on him! Too Cute!

Sadly, we outgrew him and he was sold, with full disclosure about his weight and feet requirements, to a woman [who was a marathon runner..[uh, oh...see where this is going?] who thought she could manage both the pony's weight and feet issue by taking him running with him...mainly down gravel roads.

Gee, what a suprise when her vet diagnosed him as chronically laminitic! She was actually mad at me when she returned the lame and very sore pony. The only bright spot: I got to keep the deposit to spend it on bute and a vet call."

"Obnoxious older 4-H'er asks quiet younger 4-H'er if she can borrow her fast and beautiful palomino mare for kid's game night during county fair. Younger child's mother says "no." Later that day, when her young owner was tacking the mare up for gaming, she noticed that a big chunk of the mare's mane had been mysteriously hacked off . . . "

“I had a schoolmaster QH gelding leased to a woman who was trying to breed palominos (and kept getting albino foals). She was also trying to learn to ride, which was why she leased my horse.

She told me she was going to have to return the horse early because her husband HATED geldings. The lease couldn't be up fast enough for him, she said.

Husband hauled horse back to the stable where I was boarding. When the gelding got off the trailer, I didn't recognize him. He was peaky butted and ribby. Husband hated the horse so much, he didn't want to FEED him, either.

She was upset that the horse sort of "fell" out of the trailer and skinned his shoulder. I said the shoulder scrape wasn't anything, compared to his overall condition.

I asked her if her husband hated geldings because he was jealous.

She acted like she didn't hear me, but that pencil-dicked husband of hers sure did.

The second lease was better--a little girl in 4-H classes. The horse looked like a million dollars ;o)


“Not a trade but we free leased a Mini to a "friend" for her daughter to show. We went over to drop off some paperwork for an upcoming show, and her youngest daughter took us back to see the Minis. I was appalled... ALL of the horses were thin and ribby. The Mini we sold them was so thin his hip bones stuck out, and our colt was almost as bad. Then her Mom came home and it was pretty obvious we weren't supposed to go back there. The daughter didn't seem to think there was anything wrong! We tried to talk to them about what they were feeding... She "said" she was feeding them, I have no idea what. Or when.

Fortunately, we didn't live far, so we went home and hooked up the trailer and went back and took him away. I was in tears all the way home. His body score must have been a 2-3. He made a full recovery and is still at our farm. I felt bad for the others. I should have called animal control, but they are a farce down here.

However, we did go over a month or so later and all had put weight on, so hopefully our talk worked. *sigh*”

“I was caught up in one hell of a mess in January of this year. I found a horse on that had some amazing bloodlines that we don’t often see up here in Montana . After requesting pictures, (and I was given plenty) talking to the owner over the phone, and through several emails, we struck a deal, I was to trade a nice halter/ trail mare of mine for this un -shown son of a world champion. I thought this was going to work out great; I was going to get a prospect with some real potential. So I made the arrangements to pick up this horse in South Western Idaho. I agreed to do the hauling. It was approximately 600 miles, and I had made the trip into a great reason to stop and spend time with friends on the way back.
The weather was awful, this I can’t even blame that on the miscreant, but a 9 hour drive turned into a 14 hour drive in terrible winter weather. I should have just turned around.
When we finally reached our destination, I was sick! Almost literally. We pulled up to the address of a run down home, broken down cars, and the smell of animal urine coming from the home. In the yard, the owner gleefully greets us and presents the horse. A 16.1 hand stick figure. He is severely emaciated, like nothing I have seen in person, just seen in pictures. He has a body condition score of 2. I am dumbstruck. She had advertised this horse for $3200.00, before we decided on a trade. He was nearly dead when we showed up. I had asked her what kind of bit to bring along, when I test rode him, and she said an o-ring snaffle. She gave me the story that she has been working non stop, her no good husband was supposed to be caring for the horses, and had let this poor boy waste away. She hadn’t even seen the horse in 3 weeks. WTF??? That crazy bitch had me believing I was picking up a horse worth a good deal of money, one that I could ride on the spot. It was decided instantly by my husband and I that my mare was not staying, we did unload her to stretch her legs. When she showed us around, I could have died. She had at least 20 head of mares almost all with yearlings, and most were in foal back to a rangy little stud horse. They were all knee deep in a “muddy” dirt lot, with 2 moldy bales of hay there to feed them for 2 days, till her hay delivery showed up. When we said we were leaving, she virtually begged us to take the gelding, saying she would accept payments, no money down; he was healthy that he was just bullied by the mares, and then to top off the performance she broke down crying. She said she nearly told us not to come. I wish to god with every ounce of my body she had. I took him, with the final price to be paid in payments when I could of $700.00. I was afraid he would die long before I got him back to Montana . I got him home, and started scraping the shit/mud off of him. I found out he had “Scratches” on all 4 lower legs, one serious parasitic infestation, and when I weight taped him he weighed 750 lbs. I wouldn’t send her money until I found out what I was dealing with. After 3 months of hard work, and literally 700 lbs of senior feeds, power pac worming, treating scratches in blow zero temps, hoof care(finding out he had mildly foundered approximately 6-9 months ago), and lots of “what the hell did I get into” rhetorical questions, I got my first ride. I was so excited seeing what I had accomplished, 5 steps into it I found the horse was dead lame. I couldn’t pour anymore money into him. It could have been from a 1000 things, maybe it was nothing, buit enough was enough. I called her, told her what had happened, told her I wouldn’t pay for him, and if she wanted him back I needed $500 to help cover my costs,( I put about $300.00 more than that into him), and he had to be hauled out with in 2 weeks. I have never been so sick over a decision to get rid of a horse in my life, but I couldn’t do it anymore. Who knows what else would have surfaced. So I spoiled him rotten for a week till the shipper picked him up, prayed for him and sent him back. She paid more to get him back-$500.00 to me and another $450.00 for shipping, than she agreed to take for him!!!! That bitch only took him out of spite.
So that’s my horror story. I have never had an experience this bad before, and I will damn sure never let happen again.”